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Originally Posted by oscar novak
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There is room for legitimate disagreement about when interrogation techniques may become too harsh. But I think an easy standard to apply is that if we do it to our own troops in training, we ought to be able to do it to the leaders of al Qaeda.
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This is the stupidest, most disingenuous argument for waterboarding I've seen. It's so incredibly obvious that the torture line is crossed dependent on how rigorously the technique is applied. If you think the technique experienced by our pilots during training is the same level that may be applied in captivity ... well, then you're an idiot.
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Mental and physical effects of Waterboarding
In an open letter to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, Human Rights Watch claimed that waterboarding can cause the sort of "severe pain" prohibited by 18 USC 2340 (the implementation in the US of the United Nations Convention Against Torture), that the psychological effects can last long after waterboarding ends (another of the criteria under 18 USC 2340), and that uninterrupted waterboarding can ultimately cause death.
Dr. Allen Keller, the director of the Bellevue/N.Y.U. Program for Survivors of Torture, has treated "a number of people" who had been subjected to forms of near-asphyxiation, including waterboarding. An interview for The New Yorker states, "[He] argued that it was indeed torture, 'Some victims were still traumatized years later', he said.
One patient couldn't take showers, and panicked when it rained. 'The fear of being killed is a terrifying experience,' he said."Keller also stated in his testimony before the Senate that "Water-boarding or mock drowning, where a prisoner is bound to an inclined board and water is poured over their face, inducing a terrifying fear of drowning clearly can result in immediate and long-term health consequences. As the prisoner gags and chokes, the terror of imminent death is pervasive, with all of the physiologic and psychological responses expected, including an intense stress response, manifested by tachycardia, rapid heart beat and gasping for breath.
There is a real risk of death from actually drowning or suffering a heart attack or damage to the lungs from inhalation of water. Long term effects include panic attacks, depression and PTSD. I remind you of the patient I described earlier who would panic and gasp for breath whenever it rained even years after his abuse."
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BTW, you do understand that when Assistant Attorney General Lavin went thru a trial waterboarding, as research, and was in the process of officially classifying the technique as torture, based on his experience .... he was fired by the W admin ... right?