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| Duffy Daugherty MSU Football Recruiting Forum "The Duff" is dedicated to Michigan State football recruiting discussion. Post responsibly and with respect for players, coaches, and families. Rumors and speculation should be clearly labeled as such. |
06-10-2008, 02:50 PM
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#26 (permalink)
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 #3 B.J. Cunningham
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big M
I disagree, at least if you're talking about the first ranking, which are done so early that I think its completely valid to drop a guy because often times the early rankings aren't complete or exhaustive anyways.
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well maybe they should wait until they are a little more complete before releasing a first ranking.
At this point in time last year tyler was still high in the 250 after several strong combine performances.
droping a guy in the 250 rankings is permissable based on other prospects and their performances but claiming a guy is a 4 star for so long only to drop him to a 3 star doesn't make any sense. NTM rivals didn't do any further evaluations of tyler during the period in which he was droped.
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06-10-2008, 02:53 PM
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#27 (permalink)
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#3 B.J. Cunningham
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan Pride
He was just trying to give a quick answer and help out real quick. Some of you guys are such d-bags.  |
 giving a quick anwser isn't nearly as important as giving the right anwser
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06-10-2008, 03:02 PM
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#28 (permalink)
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#97 Justin Kershaw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpartanRocky
Just for clarification
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Players are also ranked on their quality with a star ranking. A five-star prospect is considered to be one of the nation's top 25-30 players, four star is a top 250-300 or so player, three-stars is a top 750 level player, two stars means the player is a mid-major prospect and one star means the player is not ranked.
The ranking system ranks prospects on a numerical scale from 6.1-4.9.- 6.1 Franchise Player; considered one of the elite prospects in the country, generally among the nation's top 25 players overall; deemed to have excellent pro potential; high-major prospect
- 6.0-5.8 All-American Candidate; high-major prospect; considered one of the nation's top 300 prospects; deemed to have pro potential and ability to make an impact on college team
- 5.7-5.5 All-Region Selection; considered among the region's top prospects and among the top 750 or so prospects in the country; high-to-mid-major prospect; deemed to have pro potential and ability to make an impact on college team
- 5.4-5.0 Division I prospect; considered a mid-major prospect; deemed to have limited pro potential but definite Division I prospect; may be more of a role player
- 4.9 Sleeper; no Rivals.com expert knew much, if anything, about this player; a prospect that only a college coach really knew about
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So the players are compared to the other players around them. For instance a kid could be a five star top twenty player, but someone the next year will similar or better talent could be a four star because the class that year is stronger. Is that correct?
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06-10-2008, 03:10 PM
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#29 (permalink)
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#3 B.J. Cunningham
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randolph Junuh
So the players are compared to the other players around them. For instance a kid could be a five star top twenty player, but someone the next year will similar or better talent could be a four star because the class that year is stronger. Is that correct?
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yep it's subjective as shyt but damn does it feel good when your school lands a 4/5 star
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06-10-2008, 03:15 PM
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#30 (permalink)
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#41 Glenn Winston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randolph Junuh
So the players are compared to the other players around them. For instance a kid could be a five star top twenty player, but someone the next year will similar or better talent could be a four star because the class that year is stronger. Is that correct?
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Absolutely
It's all relative, the #1 player in the nation this year may not be as good as the #1 player in the nation last year
Here are the #1 players
2002: Vince Young
2003: Ernie Sims
2004: Adrian Peterson
2005: Derrick Williams (Yes, PSU's WR)
2006: Percy Harvin (Florida)
2007: Jimmy "Emu" Clausen
2008: Terrelle "Prima Dona" Pryor
Obviously clausen and williams are not on par with Peterson, Sims and Young.
You'd be suprised how much variation there is class to class. Then again, some kids can dominate HS and it just doesn't translate to college, leading to high rankings and then low results.
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06-10-2008, 03:17 PM
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#31 (permalink)
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#5 Johnny Adams
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As much as I'd like to call Emu a bust, the jury is still out on him IMO.
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06-10-2008, 03:27 PM
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#32 (permalink)
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#41 Glenn Winston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan Pride
As much as I'd like to call Emu a bust, the jury is still out on him IMO.
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Well, I didn't say he was a bust, just saying that right now he's not in the same class as the first three, all of whom were top 10 picks.
Another thing to note, that for all our complaining about the star rankings, they are pretty good. I just looked through the rivals 100 for 2002-2004 and as someone who follows college football, I can say I recognize most of the names from their play on the field. 2002 was our best class as far as top 100 player go: David Richard, Kyle Brown and William "Greg" Cooper. Too bad they didn't do much at MSU
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06-10-2008, 04:12 PM
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#33 (permalink)
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#21 Otis Wiley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PortlandSpartan
I think Caper and Spencer could drop out. No real reason, just a guess.
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Yea I'm quoting myself.
You could see the Caper free fall from a mile away. When he dropped so hard out of the top 100 you kind of knew it was coming.
Spencer I think jumped into the 250 perhaps too quickly. He showed up at that 5* camp much bigger so was bumped just on that.
Both are obviously great players and I'll take MD's evaluation any day of the week.
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06-10-2008, 04:21 PM
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#34 (permalink)
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#82 Keshawn Martin
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Caper and Spencer dropped due to NOT going to camps....Rivals basically said so. Not going to camps allowed others to impress and move up, thus moving them down.
Whatever, I am sold on these guys and MD.
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06-10-2008, 04:26 PM
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#35 (permalink)
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#41 Glenn Winston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpartanGA
Caper and Spencer dropped due to NOT going to camps....Rivals basically said so. Not going to camps allowed others to impress and move up, thus moving them down.
Whatever, I am sold on these guys and MD.
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That's what kills me, Caper was supposed to be Jonas Gray part II, and all of a sudden he's not one of the 250 best players in the country? The kid had to have done something right. . . .here's to a 2000 yard, 40 TD season for Mr. Caper 
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06-10-2008, 04:34 PM
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#36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpartanGA
Caper and Spencer dropped due to NOT going to camps....Rivals basically said so. Not going to camps allowed others to impress and move up, thus moving them down.
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Just a devils advocate thing- going to camps can be a double edged sword. If you have a good day, of course its possible they move up. On the other hand, if you have one bad or mediocre day it can cause you to drop like a rock (Newsome as an example).
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06-10-2008, 07:37 PM
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#37 (permalink)
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#17 Charlie Snow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big M
Just a devils advocate thing- going to camps can be a double edged sword. If you have a good day, of course its possible they move up. On the other hand, if you have one bad or mediocre day it can cause you to drop like a rock (Newsome as an example).
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I like how this ********* has to throw in his UM endorsement in every damn post.
Let it go. No one here gives a rats ass that Newsome (whoever the **** that is) "dropped like a rock".
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06-10-2008, 07:41 PM
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#38 (permalink)
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#61 Arthur Ray Jr.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big M
Just a devils advocate thing- going to camps can be a double edged sword. If you have a good day, of course its possible they move up. On the other hand, if you have one bad or mediocre day it can cause you to drop like a rock (Newsome as an example).
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by that logic, Garrett Gilbert, who hasn't done anything in 6 months, should be in a free fall. Instead, he is still comfortably a 5 * boy
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06-10-2008, 10:07 PM
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#39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spartaspartan
by that logic, Garrett Gilbert, who hasn't done anything in 6 months, should be in a free fall. Instead, he is still comfortably a 5 * boy
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Not really. He said it can cause you to drop, not that it will cause you to drop. The Gilbert kid (if they have enough to already evaluate him on might be a monster of a player that very few if any have a chance at passing.
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06-10-2008, 10:34 PM
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#40 (permalink)
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#23 Javon Ringer
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Why does everyone say the stars dont matter and then get so hung up on players stars
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06-10-2008, 11:08 PM
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#41 (permalink)
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#41 Glenn Winston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chitownsparty86
Why does everyone say the stars dont matter and then get so hung up on players stars
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They don't affect how good a kid is . . . but it affects the national perception of the program, coaches have saved their jobs by hauling in top 15 recruiting classes year after year. You'll hear " X Coach went 3-9, but they have the #1 recruiting class coming in, so he's secure. . . . "
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06-11-2008, 07:34 AM
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#42 (permalink)
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#53 Greg Jones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpartanRocky
They don't affect how good a kid is . . . but it affects the national perception of the program, coaches have saved their jobs by hauling in top 15 recruiting classes year after year. You'll hear " X Coach went 3-9, but they have the #1 recruiting class coming in, so he's secure. . . . "
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X Coach = Charlie Weis
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06-11-2008, 08:20 AM
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#43 (permalink)
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Harlon Barnett
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayes
Not really. He said it can cause you to drop, not that it will cause you to drop. The Gilbert kid (if they have enough to already evaluate him on might be a monster of a player that very few if any have a chance at passing.
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Can anyone name a UM commit that lost stars or actually went down ? NOt that there is a conspiracy against MSU but it seems to happen a lot with schools like MSU and rarely, if at all, with schools like UM, tOSu...
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06-11-2008, 09:02 AM
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#44 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by St8 Law
Can anyone name a UM commit that lost stars or actually went down ? NOt that there is a conspiracy against MSU but it seems to happen a lot with schools like MSU and rarely, if at all, with schools like UM, tOSu... |
You serious?
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06-11-2008, 09:24 AM
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#45 (permalink)
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#53 Greg Jones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSpartanCarolina
X Coach = Charlie Weis
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or Ron Zook, who then took a team to the Rose Bowl, although undeservingly 
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06-11-2008, 09:26 AM
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#46 (permalink)
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#53 Greg Jones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by St8 Law
Can anyone name a UM commit that lost stars or actually went down ? NOt that there is a conspiracy against MSU but it seems to happen a lot with schools like MSU and rarely, if at all, with schools like UM, tOSu... |
Not trying to rag on you, but fans from every program in both pro and college sports always feel there is someone out to get them. There may be a small bit of bias, but every program sees the drops and gains MSU does.
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