lost. toffical season 4 thread

[indiana4spartans]

Originally Posted by Pinky Tuscadero

I have just learned to expect the unexpected, and then I'm happy.

It's like an elaborate game of chess. They're already 12 steps ahead and I'm thinking about where to place my pawn.

That's exactly why I don't take this thing too seriously - I know 9.5 times out of 10, I'll be wrong! But, man it's fun to experience - it'll be awhile before something this good is on TV again, I'm afraid.

[kgbmsu]

Has anybody seen this guys theory?? Spent ALOTof time on this. Of course last weeks episode required him to change a few things.

Lost: A theory on time travel

[Snoop]

Originally Posted by Ozymandias

So...are you saying that the Jack & Desmond running in the stadium scene featured a Desmond from the future who knew Jack from the island? So he traveled back in time from the island and, instead of alerting folks of things, he thought "ya know, I think I will go for a run." If he knew Jack from the island, why not just say "hey man, never board Oceanic 815"? Why not warn the guy or tell him about the crash if he already knows about it?
I really do think that your theory is nuts. I do not think there were TWO Desmond Humes at that stadium (Future Desmond going for a run and talking to Jack while Present Desmond talks to Penny....with both wearing the same outfit).

Dude ... why aren't the "Oceanic 6" telling everyone that there are more survivors? Why did Desmond eventually let Charlie die? Everything happens for a reason Ozy and Desmond knows that Jack going to the Island must happen for things to turn out the way they eventually do.

[Ozymandias]

Originally Posted by Snoop

Dude ... why aren't the "Oceanic 6" telling everyone that there are more survivors? Why did Desmond eventually let Charlie die? Everything happens for a reason Ozy and Desmond knows that Jack going to the Island must happen for things to turn out the way they eventually do.

- I'm gonna bet money that the Oceanic 6 had to agree to some cover story put forth by their "rescuers" in order to be allowed off the island.

- How did Desmond "let" Charlie die?

- Do you think Desmond has seen the endgame already and knows that Jack has to get there? That is a massive leap to take when you consider that there is pretty much 0% chance Desmond is one of the Oceanic 6, so he would have to know if folks come back to rescue those that are left (if he is actually still alive on the island).

[Snoop]

Originally Posted by Ozymandias

-

- Do you think Desmond has seen the endgame already and knows that Jack has to get there?

Yes I do. He hasn't "seen the endgame" in real-time (as we are seeing it unfold on the island) but I do believe that in the end, he sees the endgame and the Desmond in the Stadium comes from that future.

[legend5]

Bump

Good episode tonight, looks like Snoop's theory is growing more plausible

[Polish Spartan]

Tonight's show was great. I love the Desmond/Penny story.

[Thwack]

Originally Posted by Polish Spartan

Tonight's show was great. I love the Desmond/Penny story.

I agree, although I kept thinking it seemed a little odd that Penny would break up with Desmond, then five years later after not hearing from him during that time, suddenly decide she loves him and start looking for him for three years.

[Big M]

Possibly my favorite episode of the series..amazing

[Ozymandias]

Originally Posted by Snoop

Yes I do. He hasn't "seen the endgame" in real-time (as we are seeing it unfold on the island) but I do believe that in the end, he sees the endgame and the Desmond in the Stadium comes from that future.

Do you think there are two Desmonds at the stadium, like there were two Marty McFly's in 1955 in Back to the Future 2 (the Marty from the first BTTF movie and the Marty who went back there in BTTF2)?

[Colonel Forbin]

I thought tonight's episode was very mediocre. Not horrible, but not great.


And Jesus Christ some of you need to lighten up. It's a ****ing TV show.

[goState18]

It revealed to us that there's something around the island, that screws people up, and Desmond gets to call Penny, but this is the first time in a LONG time that a problem has arised and fallen in the same episode with this show. Unless this problem really isn't gone.


So did Michael and Walt get all f'ed up too?

[Polish Spartan]

Originally Posted by Big M

Possibly my favorite episode of the series..amazing

Same here

[Pinky Tuscadero]

Originally Posted by Thwack

I agree, although I kept thinking it seemed a little odd that Penny would break up with Desmond, then five years later after not hearing from him during that time, suddenly decide she loves him and start looking for him for three years.

We don't know that Desmond doesn't jump back and meet up with her again in 1999 or something. There are too many unknowns to assume that they had no conversation between 1996 and 12/24/2004. IMHO

[Pinky Tuscadero]

All I know is that Lost has proven to be the most suspenseful and complicated show in recent memory (if not forever). I will be very sad when it is all over. Regular TV will seem simple and trivial somehow.

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by Pinky Tuscadero

We don't know that Desmond doesn't jump back and meet up with her again in 1999 or something. There are too many unknowns to assume that they had no conversation between 1996 and 12/24/2004. IMHO

That's what I couldn't figure out. The conversation last night seemed to indicate that it was the first time that they spoke in 8 years. But wasn't the stadium scene (whether it's a future desmond or not) less than 8 years ago?

[Buzzer Beater]

One of my all-time favorite episodes. Desmond is continually one of the most interesting characters on the show, and that actor doesn't get enough credit. Great job by him last night. The Desmond/Penny relationship has become my wife's favorite part of the show.

I am fully on board with Snoop's theories and I think that the rest of this season is set up to go in a really cool direction.

Also, I like that the show gave us a date last night -- Christmas Eve 2004. It's a very very interesting one to give us, because there should be a massive tsunami hitting the island in the next 24 hours. I'm not sure if they are going to go there or not, but it could make for another interesting twist.

[Ozymandias]

Originally Posted by MiamiSpartan

That's what I couldn't figure out. The conversation last night seemed to indicate that it was the first time that they spoke in 8 years. But wasn't the stadium scene (whether it's a future desmond or not) less than 8 years ago?

I didn't get the idea that they hadn't talked in 8 years at all. First off, we know they have talked more recently (the stadium scene). I think Penny's reaction was due to a) finally talking with Desmond and b) him actually keeping his word on the whole Christmas Eve 2004 thing. As for Desmond's reaction ("you still do love me" or whatever the line was), to him that probably was the first time they talked in 8 years because his memory was going to crap.

[MiamiSpartan]

Ok, a few interesting thoughts, points, and questions of mine from last night's episode:

- So this is essentially "mental" time travel, not physical. As if time travel isn't hard enough to truly wrap our minds around, they throw this curve ball? Anyone got a link to the scientific theory that this is based on? I'd be interested to read more on it.

- 2004 Desmond was the one effected (apparently by the hatch explosion) to cause this that happened to him. But 1996 Desmond didn't know anything about the island, Sayid, etc. So rather than 2004 Desmond traveling back in time (mentally, not physically), 1996 Desmond traveled forward in time as a result of what happened to 2004 Desmond. So that begs the question, where is 2004 Desmond's consciousness? This crap makes my head hurt.

- Desmond is Daniel's constant. So Daniel must be hopping around, too. That explains why he's there. It may even explain the Desmond/Penny photo, if he's the one that gave it to Naomi.

- Desmond's consciousness traveling through time is not the only space/time ripple going on. Don't let that make you forget the payload that was sent to Daniel and arrived 30 minutes late. Or that the helicopter took of at dusk, traveled 40 miles, and arrived in daylight. Right now, even more than Locke, Sayid seems to be the most in tune with what's going on. He noticed that about the daylight. He noticed that no one on the ship was surprised that there were survivors of 815, and he concluded that Ben was not their real mission.

[MiamiSpartan]

Thought I'd start a separate post for a little theorizing so as not to get too lengthy. As some of you have noticed, I have never been sold on the Dharma Revenge Mission as being the reason for the people on the boat. Too many things don't add up about that. I have also theorized (as have others) that there are multiple entities competing for the power of the island. Having said that, here are some thoughts on this:

I think the people on the boat are Widmore's. I used to wonder if Widmore was involved with Dharma, but I don't think so now. He bought the ship log of The Black Rock's captain for a lot of money. The log was put up on the auction by Hanso. If Hanso/Dharma had it, and Widmore was with them, he wouldn't need to buy it. Secondly, they were told not to answer the incoming call (which was from Penny). Daddy Widmore doesn't want Penny finding Desmond. However, the people on the boat may not know that Widmore is pulling the strings, since Minkowski didn't seem to make any connection with it being Penny. It's likely Widmore and his people knew about Dharma (since he knew to some extent what he was buying at the auction), which would explain Charlotte's interest in the Dharma tag on the polar bear skeleton. So if the people are not Dharma on the boat, then how do they know about Ben and why are they after him? I think that's explained by the passports and money and the idea I've floated before of Ben being a very big (and secretive) player in the outside world.

Personally, I think that in addition to Dharma and Widmore, there is at least one other entity involved, the one that has been the contacts/support system for the Others back in the real world.

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by Ozymandias

I didn't get the idea that they hadn't talked in 8 years at all. First off, we know they have talked more recently (the stadium scene). I think Penny's reaction was due to a) finally talking with Desmond and b) him actually keeping his word on the whole Christmas Eve 2004 thing. As for Desmond's reaction ("you still do love me" or whatever the line was), to him that probably was the first time they talked in 8 years because his memory was going to crap.

Fair points, though I don't know if it's that Desmond's memory was going to crap, but rather that he is 1996 Desmond (in his mind). So he probably doesn't even remember the stadium scene because it hadn't yet happened.

[Pinky Tuscadero]

SOME OTHER LOST SCREENS: February 2008
Here's Daniel's "cheat sheet" (as Frank calls is) with the direction Frank should follow to get back to the freighter. Also, here are some shots of the controls/meters in the helicopter including the dial that slips just over 31 as Frank flies into the thunder head. After it slips above 31, Desmond starts experiencing the "side effects."

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by Buzzer Beater

One of my all-time favorite episodes. Desmond is continually one of the most interesting characters on the show, and that actor doesn't get enough credit. Great job by him last night. The Desmond/Penny relationship has become my wife's favorite part of the show.

I am fully on board with Snoop's theories and I think that the rest of this season is set up to go in a really cool direction.

Also, I like that the show gave us a date last night -- Christmas Eve 2004. It's a very very interesting one to give us, because there should be a massive tsunami hitting the island in the next 24 hours. I'm not sure if they are going to go there or not, but it could make for another interesting twist.

Great point about the tsunami. That would be really cool if it was worked in. The timeline works perfectly for it. Geographically, I think it jives with where the divers found the "fake" plane wreckage. However, as people have pointed out, where they say that wreckage was found, would not be anywhere near a flight path from Australia to LA. Also, the freighter's last port of call was Fiji. That does fit in the flight path even if they were a few hundred miles off course (not that they're on Fiji, but I don't think Fiji would be your last port if you were headed to the Indian Ocean). But the location of the tsunami compared to where they found the wreckage, along with the time line, is definitely interesting.

I would need a refresher on Snoop's theories, but the whole idea of two different Desmond's from different times at the stadium (if I'm understanding him right) takes a hit in this episode since apparently Desmond's time travel is only through his consciousness, not physically. However, there is still some time warp that is affecting things physically such as arriving on the ship in daylight, the payload that was sent, etc.