lost. toffical season 4 thread

[goodbar]

Originally Posted by WBill

That Dharma logo is a little different, the older ones had a snake in the middle.

The center reminds me of this classic show.

There are definitely different Dharma logos seen throughout the show. Maybe the differening inner logo signifies what you do on the island, what your specialty is? I've seen a picture of a wave, snake, the "time tunnel" one, just a number 8,





Okay, here we go. Just found this on google image:




Here's more:

dharma logos link

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by PortlandSpartan

Miami, believe time moves differently now?

I was referring to a significant difference between the island and the real world (which is what everyone was talking about last week). Nothing has changed my thoughts on that, and if they do go in that direction, they have to explain the Christmas Eve call between Desmond and Penny.

However, It's been obvious before last night that there was a time difference on the island (the rocket, it taking Sayid and Desmond so long (in island time) to get to the ship). However, notice that the doctor incident would indicate that the island is ahead of the ship in the timeline, but the rocket would indicate that the island is behind the ship. I'm not sure how they plan to solve this discrepancy.

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by Cabrera'sBigStick

Anybody else think Locke was reincarnated?

Possibly, but it could have something to do with a mental time travel thing, like Desmond went through. A way to describe memory is mental time travel into the past. Therefore seeing flashes of the future (like Walt and Desmond have done) is essentially having a memory of the future. So maybe little Locke had flashes of the future (smoke monster, things that he owned), but as he grew up he rationalized it away as dreams, imagination, blocked it out of his mind, etc. Notice how he never seemed to fear the black smoke.

[AdmiralAkbar]

Originally Posted by MiamiSpartan

I was referring to a significant difference between the island and the real world (which is what everyone was talking about last week). Nothing has changed my thoughts on that, and if they do go in that direction, they have to explain the Christmas Eve call between Desmond and Penny.

However, It's been obvious before last night that there was a time difference on the island (the rocket, it taking Sayid and Desmond so long (in island time) to get to the ship). However, notice that the doctor incident would indicate that the island is ahead of the ship in the timeline, but the rocket would indicate that the island is behind the ship. I'm not sure how they plan to solve this discrepancy.

Surely they could make the island ahead of the "real world" at times and behind the "real world" at other times. Of course, assuming that this takes some kind of wave like pattern, that would mean that there is a moment where they exist in the same time. Wonder if anything cool can happen at this time?

[MiamiSpartan]

Just a couple of additional thoughts.

- Really strange how content Claire is. So far away from her personality, not caring about Aaron, etc. Maybe she is dead, as someone suggested. Who knows? Really strange.

- The guy that puts the idea of Locke going to Australia. I'm thinking we'll see him tell other people to go to Australia. He's helping to get all of these people with a destiny important to the island together. It will be very interesting to see in what capacity he shows up again.

- "He wants us to move the island"? I think this can easily go with my theory about a bend in spacetime. If they are able to control this incredible energy that bends space time near the island (likely through the electromagnetic power on the island) then there are all kinds of opportunities to use that bend to alter where in spacetime the island is.

- Horace the Mathematician. There was a mathematician named Sir Horace Lamb, who dealt a lot in physics, mostly notably dealing with the motion of fluid, hydrodynamics, etc. This may lead to some special ability to harness the power of the ocean on the show. Maybe they will use this to physically move the island to a new location (I understand that conflicts with my thoughts in the previous paragraph...just tossing some ideas out there).

[AdmiralAkbar]

Originally Posted by Enrico Palazzo

Richard has already been established as a "recruiter" for either Dharma or the Others. He's the guy who got Juliet to the island after recruiting her away from Miami to Portland (where Ben was born). The black dude who was Locke's "orderly" seems to be a Widmore agent, he came to Santa Rosa to offer Hurley money to be quiet and then gave Naomi her instructions for the mission. He took the place of Richard in stalking Locke.

I don't get what was up with Locke picking the knife and Richard's meltdown over it. Anyone have any idea?

Also, it seems that the Oceanic 6 is going to be introduced to the world next week (unless that preview was just foreshadowing the rest of the season) and my observation is they have been told how to act, as they were told they will be known as "the Oceanic 6" before being unveiled to the public.

Well, as we have seen here there is obviously some bending of space and time going on. The thing is, what happens if you go back and ask a key player in island events (like Locke) certian questions, and they answer the same every time, but one day they pick differently?

Look at what was on the table: A vial of gold, a baseball mitt, a compass, a superhero comic, a knife, a book on laws... these are all very specific topics. What if the knife means he will fight later in life? What if, by asking a child to select from these objects, they can judge how they will behave in future situations? Would this Dharma/Other guy be distressed to know that one of his future enemies has suddenly decided to fight his fate in the future?

[Thwack]

A few interesting observations about Locke from last night: 1) Seems like Locke can't die, like Michael, as he was the earliest preemie to survive at that hospital, survived an eight-story fall, was shot by Ben and left for dead but survived, etc.; 2) Thought it was interesting that his teacher was trying to convince the 16-year-old Locke that he might not want to be a scientist, but a scientist is who he is, which conflicts with Locke's claims to Jack that Jack is a man of science but Locke is a man of faith; 3) When he then screamed "Don't ever tell me what I can't do!" at that teacher, I'm pretty sure he yelled the same thing in season 1 in the episode when he wanted to go on the walkabout but they wouldn't let him because of his handicap. Not that that's important, but just thought it was interesting.

[PortlandSpartan]

Originally Posted by MikeE

That is exactly what I was thinking when he was sorting through the stuff trying pick out "his stuff".

Me too.

[PortlandSpartan]

Originally Posted by Bandito

She's dead.

Yup. This is why Miles had a strange obsession with her last episode.

My question then is, why could Sawyer see/talk to her?

[stony1332]

Another thing that I thought was strange . . . remember the last episode or two when the doctor washed up on shore and then the second in command of the mercenary unit received the morris code message saying that the doctor had washed up but actually we saw the death in the most recent episode. Maybe the island is ahead of normal time? Or is that too far of a reach?

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by AdmiralAkbar

Surely they could make the island ahead of the "real world" at times and behind the "real world" at other times. Of course, assuming that this takes some kind of wave like pattern, that would mean that there is a moment where they exist in the same time. Wonder if anything cool can happen at this time?

It's fiction, so the writers could make anything happen. I just hope they give it a reasonable explanation.

As I think about it, however, the only things that we KNOW where timelines sync are phone/radio conversations. For example, Faraday was talking to the ship in real time, though it took the rocket 30 extra minutes to get there. Desmond was talking to Penny in real time, Charlie talked to Penny in real time, and Minkowski had the signal from Penny coming in real time (by real time, I mean that there was no delay in their conversation). So two things could be in play. Either something moving at the speed of light or having little mass (radio or phone signals would fit both of those) can pass through this disruption in spacetime with no problems. Or, by the signal going up to the satellite, then back down to earth, it bypasses this spacetime disruption, which is closer to the surface. I'm not sure if Penny's signal that Charlie got was sent via satellite or a radio signal.

So any larger object (plane, boat, rocket, etc.) could take MUCH longer to get where it's going relative to real time. So it's not that time is moving faster or slower on the island versus the real world, but that it takes things MUCH longer to get from point A to point B than it should unless you follow a very specific heading.

Some might say that the whole doctor incident doesn't fit in with the concept of it taking longer than it should to get to and from the island. On the other hand, what are the chances of his body following the exact heading needed to get to the island "safely"? So perhaps by floating on a different heading, it got there quicker through the bend in spacetime. This seems like it has to be the case, otherwise Sayid in a boat would have shown up on the island LONG before the floating body.

As a side note, Faraday said to go on a heading of 305 FROM the island. The pilot told Sayid to go on a heading of 305 TO the island. Wouldn't that need to be a heading of 125 to go back in the direction they came from? Did he send Sayid off course, or is that a writer's mistake?

[Captain Obvious]

Originally Posted by Entertainment Weekly

Which brings me to the provocative Big Idea that I strongly believe ''Cabin Fever'' was jerking its head toward, hoping that we would ''get it'' without spelling it out. There was a moment last night when Ben accused Locke of manipulating Hurley into going with them to Jacob's cabin by using Ben-patented reverse psychology. Locke denied doing so, saying, ''I'm not you.'' Ben jumped on this, saying, ''You're certainly not.''

Now, do the timeline math.

Locke is born early. At age 5, he takes a test that most likely would have taken him to the Island if he had passed. He didn't. That same year, Benjamin Linus is born. At age 16, Locke is invited to go to a science camp that again would have taken him to the Island. He refused. About that same time, Benjamin Linus and his father joined the Dharma Initiative. The implication, it seems, is that Ben has been walking the path that was originally meant for Locke. Ben was the contingency plan — the course correction — for Locke's altered destiny. But Ben is his own person, of course, and he has done things differently from what Locke would have done, and this, in turn, has created further changes in the original order of things — changes that I think a certain ticked-off, Island-deprived billionaire named Charles Widmore is trying to reverse. The scene at the rehab center between paralyzed adult Locke and his wheelchair pusher, the creepy Matthew Abbaddon — who accepted the description of ''orderly'' with knowing irony — was meant to suggest one way Widmore is scheming to restore the original order: by getting Locke on that Island and taking back the birthright that was supposed to be his.

[Home for the Holidays]

Looks like Jack's conclusion that the tracker was dropped to encourage the survivors to follow the copter is a mistake.

[tenaciousb]

time on the island speeds up and slows down based upon the tide
that's why the scientist was able to do calculations to figure it out or at least try to

[Bandito]

Originally Posted by PortlandSpartan

Yup. This is why Miles had a strange obsession with her last episode.

My question then is, why could Sawyer see/talk to her?

Island mojo similar to Jack seeing Christian, etc.

The show gives me such a mind ******.

Sure it's already posted and people have been quoting it verbatim, but my favorite place to go after the show is
'Lost' recap: Finding the cabin | Lost | 1 | TV Recaps | EW.com

any other good ones out there?

[tenaciousb]

oh and for the record the black guy was a slave on the ship and the guy who was scoping locke out was a native. jacob was the captain or something and some sort of incident occurred with all four that led them to constantly be in play over time. also is it possible jacob is a manifestation of whitmore or something like that? what if whitmore is the ancestor of jacob and ben knows if he kills whitmore he'll upset jacob and the island, thereby causing catastrophe to erupt

[Bandito]

Originally Posted by tenaciousb

oh and for the record the black guy was a slave on the ship and the guy who was scoping locke out was a native. jacob was the captain or something and some sort of incident occurred with all four that led them to constantly be in play over time. also is it possible jacob is a manifestation of whitmore or something like that? what if whitmore is the ancestor of jacob and ben knows if he kills whitmore he'll upset jacob and the island, thereby causing catastrophe to erupt

Where'd you get this info from?

[Hockeyfreak]

Does anyone else think that Jacob might be Richard Alpert? It makes since seeing he was the one who "recruited" Ben into the others. Hwe is also seen as the same age no matter when and where and how long ago the flashback was. He is also the recruiter of those who are "needed" by the island.

I could be way off here, but isnt that what makes the show so great? There can be so many theories about anything on the show.

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by WBill

Looks like Jack's conclusion that the tracker was dropped to encourage the survivors to follow the copter is a mistake.

Jack's conclusion was right (as that was the pilot's intention). Whether or not it was a mistake to follow it, depends on your point of view. Short term it got them off the island. Long term, it is a mistake to leave the island.

[MiamiSpartan]

Originally Posted by tenaciousb

time on the island speeds up and slows down based upon the tide
that's why the scientist was able to do calculations to figure it out or at least try to

Interesting theory, only because "horace the mathematician" might reference Sir Horace Lamb, a British mathematician whose most notable work was on hydrodynamics. However, I can't imagine how they would explain it with any remotely accepted scientific theory (though maybe I need to do some brief research on hydrodynamics).

It may be that they won't try to explain the time issues through scientific theory. However, if they start just pulling things out of their butt and explain it away with nothing more than "because the island has special powers" that's pretty weak for a show that is so intellectual at it's root. I'm willing to accept some mysticism with things like the black smoke, or how the island "wants" certain things to happen. But if the show incorporates so many references to the groundbreaking physics research of the 20th century, it would be weak if they suddenly throw that all out the window.

[Ozymandias]

Originally Posted by Enrico Palazzo

I don't get what was up with Locke picking the knife and Richard's meltdown over it. Anyone have any idea?

It's like the Dalai Lama test:

Upon the death of the Dalai Lama and consultation with the Nechung Oracle, a search for the Lama's reincarnation, or yangsi (yang srid), is conducted. Familiarity with the possessions or attributes of the previous Dalai Lama is considered the main sign of the tulku. The search for the reincarnated mindstream typically requires a number of years. The reincarnated being is then installed and trained by the other Lamas.

I'm gonna guess that the previous leader on the island had recently died and Alpert thought that young John was the reincarnation of said leader. I think he wanted him to pick the comic book (which mentioned "Hidden Land" or something of that nature), to symbolize the island.

Originally Posted by PortlandSpartan

Yup. This is why Miles had a strange obsession with her last episode.

Really like this theory.