Aviation School

[jzman74]

I am thinking about making a complete career change and becoming an airline pilot. Has anyone on here graduated from a aviation school or know of any good schools to go to? I welcome any advise.

[Fromunda Cheese]

I don't know if this is what you're looking for...but anyways, WMU has a great aviation program that historically competes with North Dakota as the top aviation school in the country.

The Dean is a former pilot/instructor and upper management from United Airlines.

WMU's College of Aviation has educated aviation professionals since 1939 and offers complete academic degree programs leading to a bachelor's degree in three areas--aviation flight science, aviation management and maintenance technology. The college enrolls more than 700 students and is home to the Sky Broncos, a precision flight team that has been among the top three in national competition for 17 consecutive years.

Check them out here: WMU College of Aviation

[VanderbiltSpartan]

I work for a major airline and would recommend you check out Embry Riddle in Daytona, FL. All the airlines hire from here (for corporate and front line). The biggest advantage of this school, in my observation, is a very tight and active alumni network. Good luck!

[Herman Melville]

Middle Georgia College Aviation Campus

If you all ready have a four year degree just go somewhere and get your ratings. My daughter and I are both airline pilots. Job ain't what it used to be, but what is? PM me if you want more info. Plenty of info here.jetcareers.com - Welcome

Embry Riddle is way overpriced.

[theMSUbob]

WMU and Embry Riddle are top schools but will costs 100k+. You can get the same ratings and license for much much cheaper. You might not work your way up as quick but it;s all about who ya know really.Check out Considering a career as an airline pilot? Read this - Airline Pilot Central Forums

[JazzyGR]

I thought the job prospects for airline pilots are worse than just about any other profession?

[GRR Spartan]

Its not the great job it was 20 years ago. Lower pay and worse schedules.

[pulling69]

Originally Posted by JazzyGR

I thought the job prospects for airline pilots are worse than just about any other profession?

Not really since there is always turn over when pilots are forced to stop flying with the airlines when they turn 65. Starting out at the bottom sucks and you will make hardly any money for a few years. Once you have "paid your dues" so to speak, build some seniority, and become a captain then things are much better.

FYI I make more money not using my commercial license or flight instructor license right now doing other work with corporate aircraft. As far as going to school for a pilot job do a lot of research. WMU is great but overpriced, same thing for Embry Riddle. There are tons of training schools and some are better than others(some have a bad reputation with the airlines based on how the schools try to push through their program).

Look at schools that have good partnerships with airlines that at least gurantee you interviews, type ratings, and have a good reputation for crew resource managment.

[PipersFly]

I would suggest Embry Riddle. You cannot do better. A decent runnerup is WMU and a sleeper is tOSU. I wish you good luck, and I rank Embry Riddle as the clear winner. You will have a fine career having completed their course of study and training.

[Foxbat]

If you already have a four year degree, get your certificates and ratings. All they care about is your total flight time, multiengine time, and for the airlines, if you have a four year degree. Naturally you won't show up for an interview till you have your commercial multiengine certificate and like 500hrs of time.

Nobody gives a **** about USNews rankings. WMU and ERAU are cute, but a 1500hr pilot with 500hr multiengine will beat a lower experience grad from there any day.

Don't expect to make much money for the first decade.

[TechSpartan]

Becoming a pilot is a lot like becoming a lawyer. In that there are not a whole lot of jobs out there right now and the jobs you can get are really low paying. I'm talking in the 20,000s low paying. The truth is it just is not worth it. Get crappy pay, spend a lot of time away from family and there is the constant fear of cutbacks.

What has caused the problem is that so many people think flying would be a fun career. Airlines used to get the majority of pilots from the military. Then a bunch of these private flight school started popping up and advertising(cause they are for profit entities) and in general just more people started to get their commercial licenses.

All of this has resulted in the market being flooded with pilots. It is so bad that there are instances of young pilots with all their ratings paying companies to let them fly their planes just so they can build up hours so they are able to even be considered by the larger companies. That's right, pilots paying the company they work for!

Embry Riddle is a nice school if you are rich. Going there just cause you want to be a pilot is overkill and not needed.

The best option is to just go to your local airport and start getting all your ratings. When you are able to become a flight instructor to get your hours up and help offset some of the cost.

I've also found that many people that want to become pilots are a lot like people that want to become lawyers. You can beat them over the head again and again with how bad the job market is and how the life of a pilot is not what it once was but these kids will still go do it and they'll be paying off huge loans and have a low paying job.

Here's a great site. I highly encourage you to visit the forums and ask these guys what their feelings are.

jetcareers.com - Welcome

[Murky Waters]

If you’re still young enough, have a college degree and 20/20 vision, you may want to consider applying for flight training with one of the branches of the military. That’s what I did after graduating MSU in 81 with no decent jobs prospects due to a crappy economy. (I flew nine years active duty Navy followed by two years Naval Reserves then commercially).

Rather than spending your own money on flight training, the military pays you to learn how to fly. Pretty good deal. Plus, the experience you’ll gain while flying for the military is the type the airlines and large corporations find highly desirable. Of course, there is a down side as the military lifestyle, particularly military aviation, is not for everyone, so you’d have to investigate that and take it under consideration.

[PipersFly]

deterred by the overkill comments. Certainly there are many ways to skin a cat, and you check out all of them. However, at the end of the day you will come to learn that Embry Riddle is the best of the bunch and will be an asset to you for your entire career, whatever path you ultimately choose. You can find a way, I did.

[TechSpartan]

Cost for Everything - Jetcareers

Has your ERAU Degree given you any advantage - Jetcareers

[theMSUbob]

Originally Posted by Murky Waters

If you’re still young enough, have a college degree and 20/20 vision, you may want to consider applying for flight training with one of the branches of the military. That’s what I did after graduating MSU in 81 with no decent jobs prospects due to a crappy economy. (I flew nine years active duty Navy followed by two years Naval Reserves then commercially).

Rather than spending your own money on flight training, the military pays you to learn how to fly. Pretty good deal. Plus, the experience you’ll gain while flying for the military is the type the airlines and large corporations find highly desirable. Of course, there is a down side as the military lifestyle, particularly military aviation, is not for everyone, so you’d have to investigate that and take it under consideration.

Please explain this futher. Seems to me that most of the military flight positions are filled by those who are in the ROTC, etc. Not just someone showing up at the door with a college degree and perfect eyesight.

[Murky Waters]

Originally Posted by theMSUbob

Please explain this futher. Seems to me that most of the military flight positions are filled by those who are in the ROTC, etc. Not just someone showing up at the door with a college degree and perfect eyesight.

I have no idea how it works now days, so it may not be an option for the OP. Just thought I'd throw it out there as something to be investigated.

In the early 80s, however, the military was pushing a lot of pilots through their training pipelines. I met the basic requirements -- a four year degree, 20/20 eyesight, good physical shape and had passed both the Navy's and Air Force's flight training aptitude exam given by the respective local (Grand Rapids) recruiters.

Prior to submitting my application to the selection boards of both branches of service, I went out to my local airport and earned my private pilot license, doing so in three months.

Fourteen weeks of Aviation Officer Candidate School in Pensacola, Fla, got me my commission. Approximately fifteen months of primary and advanced training (at two different bases--one near Pensacola and one in Texas) got me my wings.

[Herman Melville]

Originally Posted by Murky Waters

I

Fourteen weeks of Aviation Officer Candidate School in Pensacola, Fla, got me my commission. Approximately fifteen months of primary and advanced training (at two different bases--one near Pensacola and one in Texas) got me my wings.

Which AOC class were you in. I was 29-82. Wings Kingsville July 84.

[Foxbat]

Originally Posted by theMSUbob

Please explain this futher. Seems to me that most of the military flight positions are filled by those who are in the ROTC, etc. Not just someone showing up at the door with a college degree and perfect eyesight.

You can get a competitive flying slot by joining OCS, not just undergrad ROTC with UPT or joining one of the military academies. So basically, it's filled by people with the tenacity and effort to research it and apply/talk to the right people and show up at the door well prepared with a relevant college degree, good eyesight, and physically fit.

My friend didn't make the flying slot cut (yet?) but got his second pick of surface warfare.

[Murky Waters]

Originally Posted by Herman Melville

Which AOC class were you in. I was 29-82. Wings Kingsville July 84.

Class 14-83.
Gunnery Sgt. Thixton, U.S.M.C. (his last class).
Wings in Dec. 1984 at NAS Corpus Christi.

[hoosierspartan]

I've been a corporate pilot for over 20 years. It's a long ladder to climb but I love it. However, nowadays the market is flooded with lots of furloughed pilots. It's going to be a few years until this all settles out. So be patient. It's just the nature of this beast.
I went the local airport route. Getting my ratings one step at a time, flying weekends while working a full time job during the week. It's hard but it can be done It's also cheaper going this route. Embry Riddle and WMU are very good but expensive. As mentioned by others you could have a student loan well over $100,000 by the time you get done.
The key is getting the FAA ratings anyway you can. There all the same. Then go the Flight Instructor route, teaching, building hours and getting paid for it. While instructing you'll start to get asked to fly with guys like me who need a co-pilot on some trips. It's harder these days then when I was coming up because of the tight insurance requirments but the opportunities are still there. Eventually if your good enough and (just as important but nobody talks about this aspect) can work well as a team member within the cockpit enviroment then job opportunites should eventually come your way. Persistance will pay off, but it will take some time.
My son went the military route. Is now 28 years old, been flying for about 5 years. Is now a very experienced helicopter pilot. Has pretty good job prospects when he plans on getting out later this year. The military route went well for him but again, it's not for everybody.
Another plan might be to look at your local National Guard opportunities. Most Nat'l Guard squadrons have a few slots each year to hand out to pilots applicants. You train just like the regular military but on a Nat'l Guard schedule so to speak. My son has said that the Guard boys are very cool guys who don't get all caught up in the spit & polish that the regular military enjoys.
Good luck....

[Murky Waters]

Originally Posted by Herman Melville

Which AOC class were you in. I was 29-82. Wings Kingsville July 84.

That must’ve been Battalion I, by the way. I was Bat II.

Trying to remember the names of other drill instructors there at the time. All I can come up with is Sgts. Goforth and Campos. Been too long.

[Compton Otter Pop]

My friend told me that this was on here and I wanted to chime in.

I went to Embry Riddle (and an MSU fan from Lansing). I'm now an airline pilot at a regional. If you already have a four year degree - in anything, you are set for college requirement that the airlines want. You need to find a local flying club or "FBO" as some are known which offers flight instruction. Start with your private and work your way up to Flight Instructor (CFI). Once you are a CFI, you can start instructing people without having to pay for flying. I say without having to pay for flying because you get paid hardly anything. Once you build around 1000 hours total with about 200-250 hours multi-engine time, the airlines will look at you.

That being said, the airlines aren't hiring right now. A lot of pilots with 5000 hours and turbine engine time are on the street looking for work which will obviously take the job over a CFI with 1000 hours of piston engine time. The aviation industry is cyclical and right now is probably the bottom of the down cycle. Age 65 and the recession hurt the hiring big time. It will probably take about a year to a year and a half if you do it full time to get the requirements. I think now is the perfect time to start to be ready for the next upswing.

Being an airline pilot isn't for everyone. I've wanted to do it since I was about five, and have an understanding wife. You're gone about four days of the week - if you live in base, if not, even more time on the road. There are ways of being home more often, but this is a senority based industry and you have to be senior enough to do it. Another thing is, you don't make a whole lot while starting out - $30K a year if you're lucky. The potential to make six figures is quite attainable, but it will take some time.

If this is something you really want to do, then by all means, go for it. The sites that have been posted are good ones. Look around them and see what you think. I love my job and wouldn't want anything else. PM me if you have any specfic questions.

Hope this helps.

[Murky Waters]

I have a buddy from my Navy days who even after attaining enough seniority to hold a line, all he did every month was bid reserve, so he could go out on days in which he was not called in to fly (which was quite often, I guess) and mess around in his Pitts Special.

That was quite some time ago, though (and, yes, he was single). Don't know if they allow that anymore.

[Herman Melville]

Originally Posted by Murky Waters

Class 14-83.
Gunnery Sgt. Thixton, U.S.M.C. (his last class).
Wings in Dec. 1984 at NAS Corpus Christi.

Man, Thixton was nuts. I guess I was in Batt II. Started out with Wendt, halfway through they moved him to Batt I and my class finished with Gunney Walker. Long time ago.

[Murky Waters]

Originally Posted by Herman Melville

Man, Thixton was nuts. I guess I was in Batt II. Started out with Wendt, halfway through they moved him to Batt I and my class finished with Gunney Walker. Long time ago.

OK, Wendt and Walker (we called him Boo-boo) now come to mind. Wendt was the sorta tall guy wearing the birth control glasses, IIRC.

And, yes, Thixton was a bastard.

He prided himself on having the most DORs of any D.I.. We started with a class of 52 and graduated 29 (and a few of the 29 joined the class the last week or so after being on medical hold for awhile).