How good would state's b-ball team be if izzo recruited more than three states

Taco John · 10-14-2009, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

In the last decade if we had recruited Michigan better and forgot the rest of the country we may well have won another national championship or two. It's not where you recruit but how and who you recruit. I'll give you two names for instance, Chris Kamen and Al Horford.

Hey, you stole our argument!

Signed,
Irrational Hoosier Fan

SCOTTS BLOATED LIVER · 10-14-2009, 05:20 PM

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Originally Posted by Donnyrotten

To the OP...

Thank god your here

Again, Donnydumb**** not able to properly use You're /your...

Zumayas arm · 10-14-2009, 05:31 PM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

Probably time for you to eat a dick now, bitch.

This

Zumayas arm · 10-14-2009, 05:37 PM

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Originally Posted by BleedGreen4ever

I shouldn't have mentioned Kansas, they weren't good last year, but you get my point...2000 was one of those years that you had enough talent and athleticism that you didn't need a big man. Now, the national powers almost always do have very good, big, strong and mobile big men that we have had trouble with. If that is all the other team has (Pitt), then we can handle them. But if they have the whole package (NC) we get eaten alive. We are a perennial Final 4 team, but to win it all we need to be better, that that is where the big man comes in. Watch the last few games against NC and tell me you disagree with me. We get very one dimensional against teams like that, and if we aren't draining 3's we get killed.

Yeah, they were horrible

And with no big man.

Ozymandias · 10-14-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

In the last decade if we had recruited Michigan better and forgot the rest of the country we may well have won another national championship or two. It's not where you recruit but how and who you recruit. I'll give you two names for instance, Chris Kamen and Al Horford.

Kaman came out of nowhere, you can't predict that one. And Horford has been discussed ad nauseum here. The kid wanted to get out of Michigan no matter what. He needed to get away from his overbearing father. He showed very little interest in being a Spartan.

MSUtopia · 10-14-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozymandias

Kaman came out of nowhere, you can't predict that one. And Horford has been discussed ad nauseum here. The kid wanted to get out of Michigan no matter what. He needed to get away from his overbearing father. He showed very little interest in being a Spartan.

The point is that there are big men in the state and it is not necessary to go out of state to find them. I don't buy your Horford scenario, but so what? I'm happy.

macspartan · 10-14-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

The point is that there are big men in the state and it is not necessary to go out of state to find them. I don't buy your Horford scenario, but so what? I'm happy.

We did recruit Horford strong, Ozy was right, Horford wanted to go out of state, but since your happy......that proves IGNORANCE IS BLISS

Ozymandias · 10-14-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

The point is that there are big men in the state and it is not necessary to go out of state to find them. I don't buy your Horford scenario, but so what? I'm happy.

You don't buy my Horford scenario? Fine.

Al Horford rarely showed any interest in being a Spartan. He made very few appearances on campus even though he had a long-standing invite to show up whenever he wanted. His parents were more into him being a Spartan than he was---mainly because that meant their little boy would be close to home. Compare him with Goran Suton, a local kid in the same class. Suton had the same open-door policy when it came to visiting campus and he was there all the time over the summer and fall. He would play pickup ball with the MSU players 3-4 times/week, when he wasn't on the road for AAU stuff. Horford showed up MAYBE 3-4 times the entire summer.

It was best for Al Horford's career that he leave the state. He needed to step away and become his own man. Going to MSU or UM would not have allowed that to happen.

Gnossos · 10-14-2009, 07:29 PM

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Originally Posted by BleedGreen4ever

I think what the poster is getting at (in the wrong way) is that Izzo has failed to land a big man that can put us over the top and beat the likes of NC, Kansas, etc. P. Davis has been the closest, but in my estimation he underachieved (with respect to what he was hyped to be). He was a great Spartan, but could not get us to the top. We still don't have that big guy that can dominate, and with a program at our level and expectation, that IS a problem. Herzog is a huge disapointment so far, maybe he's progressing, but his lack of strength and mobility will likely limit him for his career. Maybe one of the freshman coming in will be that guy that can step in right away and solidify us at Center, but I still don't see anyone coming here that will help give us a Nat Championship.

Kansas?

How many times did we beat Kansas last year with their stud big?

Ozymandias · 10-14-2009, 07:30 PM

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Originally Posted by Gnossos

Kansas?

How many times did we beat Kansas last year with their stud big?

Ignore Bleedgreen, he's a fool.

Gnossos · 10-14-2009, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BleedGreen4ever

I shouldn't have mentioned Kansas, they weren't good last year, but you get my point...2000 was one of those years that you had enough talent and athleticism that you didn't need a big man. Now, the national powers almost always do have very good, big, strong and mobile big men that we have had trouble with. If that is all the other team has (Pitt), then we can handle them. But if they have the whole package (NC) we get eaten alive. We are a perennial Final 4 team, but to win it all we need to be better, that that is where the big man comes in. Watch the last few games against NC and tell me you disagree with me. We get very one dimensional against teams like that, and if we aren't draining 3's we get killed.

Kansas wasn't good?

612 Virginia · 10-14-2009, 07:44 PM

It is one thing to be dumb, it is another thing to prove it to everyone.

flywheel99 · 10-14-2009, 07:59 PM

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Originally Posted by G35beger

I understand he didn't have to for guards / forwords , but recruiting more than three states for a center would have helped

Just wondering, what centers "should" have Izzo pursued?

Ozymandias · 10-14-2009, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flywheel99

Just wondering, what centers "should" have Izzo pursued?

Or "forwords".

Heat Miser · 10-14-2009, 08:53 PM

Davis - '02 - 5*
Naymick - '03 - 4*
Donger & Suton - '04 - 3*
Herzog - '06 - 4*
Sherman & Nix - '09 - 4*

Coach Ks bad back · 10-14-2009, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

In the last decade if we had recruited Michigan better and forgot the rest of the country we may well have won another national championship or two. It's not where you recruit but how and who you recruit. I'll give you two names for instance, Chris Kamen and Al Horford.

Yeah, we should've landed Horford, and Roberson too. Not to mention Malik Hairston.

Why didn't Mason and Hollis authorize Izzo to open up the checkbook to get these guys?

reg_hartner · 10-14-2009, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSUtopia

The point is that there are big men in the state and it is not necessary to go out of state to find them. I don't buy your Horford scenario, but so what? I'm happy.

Not to mention Horford was recruited as a forward. He's added 2 inches and 40 lbs since his recruitment, but if we brought him in as a 6'8" 211 lbs center this board would have bitched up a storm that Izzo is recruiting undersized centers.

That same year we had Gray who was also 6'8", but 215 lbs. Idong and Suton who were both 6'10" and 250 lbs. So do you think we should have taken the 4 star that didn't want to be here over the 5 star that did want to be here? (This is not about what they became, but at the time everyone in the country thought Gray might be a 1 and done.)

Power forward
Grand Ledge, Michigan
Grand Ledge
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Ht:6'8"
Wt:211 lbs
Class:2004 (High School)

Denver Spartanhead · 10-14-2009, 11:24 PM

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Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

Probably time for you to eat a dick now, bitch.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Seoul Spartan · 10-15-2009, 01:23 AM

Never doubt Izzo

Spartan Punk · 10-15-2009, 02:46 AM

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Originally Posted by MSULordyoda

And FTR, Last year MSU beat Kansas twice...beat UConn who had Thabeet, and beat Pittsburgh in 2008 with DuJuan Blair. Do you remember that or not?

You need to buy a clue as well.

Speaking of needing to buy a clue, do you not remember that last year we could throw 3 5th year seniors at the center position vs Kansas, UConn and Pitt? Big difference than playing freshmen or undersized players out there.

A lack of a true big experienced center is a major concern whether MSU fans want to believe it or not, mostly on the defensive end and rebounding.

The Truman Show · 10-15-2009, 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan Punk

Speaking of needing to buy a clue, do you not remember that last year we could throw 3 5th year seniors at the center position vs Kansas, UConn and Pitt? Big difference than playing freshmen or undersized players out there.

A lack of a true big experienced center is a major concern whether MSU fans want to believe it or not, mostly on the defensive end and rebounding.

Well sure, this year MSU is not going to be as good at the C position as they were last year. That's what happens when a quality, experienced player like Suton graduates. No one said that isn't a concern.

MSULordyoda · 10-15-2009, 09:15 AM

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Originally Posted by Spartan Punk

Speaking of needing to buy a clue, do you not remember that last year we could throw 3 5th year seniors at the center position vs Kansas, UConn and Pitt? Big difference than playing freshmen or undersized players out there.

A lack of a true big experienced center is a major concern whether MSU fans want to believe it or not, mostly on the defensive end and rebounding.

Read my post very carefully. You completely missed the point of my response.

Spartan Punk · 10-15-2009, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSULordyoda

Read my post very carefully. You completely missed the point of my response.

No, you made 2 points in your responce. One was we didn't have a dominating center in 2000. The other was that we beat teams that did last year.

Regarding 2000, we ended up being fortunate that no team that got matched up against us had a true center either, except for Syracuse with Eton Thomas. The best player we played against all tournament was Fizer who we matched up against very well. Plus in 2000, we had a ton of experience down low with Hutson and Granger. That makes a huge difference over relying on freshmen down low.