Why is it that....

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by State

Does our success in the 50s and 60s really have that much impact on this decade? I'm all for the tradition thing but come on, that is not what is still bringing Spartan fans to SS every year

Most you can look at when deciding on return on investment etc is 20 years with respect to a program.

for many of us it;s less than that. Me personally it;s 15 years or so of being a fan. My return is very small.

[MForce2k]

Because some people are still insecure about a program that is trying to establish itself. They want people in 200% and won't accept anything else, and it's sad.

I really consider THIS age of Spartan football to have begun in 2007, and my impression is that a lot of others have. So we have this flux period of a few years where some people expect everyone to just be 'all in' and be completely loyal, and any kind of reasonable, moderate discussion is just seen as heresy. It's discouraging because we don't need to be a divided fanbase right now like those down the road in AA. We need to be helping this program get a foothold and take the next step. One down year doesn't take away everything that Dantonio has done.

[Artie Loves Pancakes]

Originally Posted by Negotiator

Yep. Here's the thing, though: How much of that is coaching and how much of it is simply not having the running threat there? We just don't have a bruiser right now that can mow people down to get three yards. I dunno if it's Caper or the O-line, but we just don't have it. That being the case, the opposing defense just needs to worry about the pass and tell the D-line to make sure you get a good push.

You're right... we don't have a running threat yet we continue to try and pound it in from inside the 10. It's maddening. Last night on two separate occasions from inside the 5 we went run for no gain, run for no gain, incomplete pass. It's idiotic playcalling, so it goes to the coaches.


As for the original post... who cares if people jump ship in the middle of a bad year? It's to be expected. I don't blame em actually. I'm the type of person where I wouldn't waste the money I already spent on tickets by not going... plus I like to go up to EL and drink a few beers with people I don't see enough. But I'm pissed at the coaching staff and the way this year has been handled and I don't blame anyone for expressing that frustration by skipping games. We will all be filled up on green Kool-Aid next August with high hopes yet again...

[Plate of Shrimp]

Originally Posted by State

Does our success in the 50s and 60s really have that much impact on this decade? I'm all for the tradition thing but come on, that is not what is still bringing Spartan fans to SS every year

What exactly brings Spartans back to SS every year?

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by Negotiator

Square peg, round hole. Sounds like (yecch) Rodriguez's problem last season. Ah well. Two more tailgates, two more times to meet up with friends and see some friends in the band take the field.

OR dare I say it...inept coordinating.

Treadwell has had some serious issues over his three year run. Ringer covered up alot of it. we have a trememndous passing attack yet he refuses to use it in the red zone, more specifically inside the 10. Mindboggling. trememndous TE's, solid WR's...yet we bang away with ZERO success.

Go back and look at the film at how many times we line up power set inside 10 and run middle. It's a shocking number.

but what the ****, I'm not a coach so I cannot comment according to some here.

[charliemarlow]

MSU may no longer be a football school...MSU used football to build itself into a major international university. Football got the name recognition, student interest, and alumni and corporate money, presumably. The games now are great to go to because of the campus and the atmosphere, but I think many people, especially students, are not wrapped up in it like they are at, well, u-m.
What bothers me about the negative responses on the board is that so many are not just frustrated and critical, but they are full of contempt and self-hatred. These are the guys who maybe wanted to go someplace else, or didn't have the great time at State I did. Or maybe they are chumps at their own jobs.
I am very frustrated with the team this year. I do think we were set up last year because of Hoyer and Ringer. (Many of those same people considered Hoyer a teRrible qb and must be quite perplexed by the New England Patriots' decision to make him back-up to Brady.)
But I am also upset that the team did not appear ready to play Saturday and that, according to Minnesota player statements, they had our defense completely read. It sure looked that way. I expect action to be taken to change things...and by expect, I don't mean demand. I believe Dantonio is not an idiot, so I am sure he will make chanes. I also know that I can judge results, but that I really don't know why certain players are doing certain things - whether it is because they are being mis-coached or are not up to the job. And if they are not up to the job, if they can be taught and trained to be up to be job. And if not, if they are our only choices.
At the end of the game, I am like the band members who march away, win or lose, chanting, "Go, State, Beat Western." And always,
GO, STATE

[Plate of Shrimp]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

Most you can look at when deciding on return on investment etc is 20 years with respect to a program.

for many of us it;s less than that. Me personally it;s 15 years or so of being a fan. My return is very small.

THEN STOP GOING....

If MSU hasn't won enough, save for 2 years, over a 20 year period, why do you go expecting them to win? Why is the win-loss record the determining factor for going when the team hasn't ever consistently won.

I mean, WTF are you expecting and how are they falling short? How are you not getting "return" on your investment?

[GRR Spartan]

Mikey Mikey Mikey. It isn't the same movie every year.
There are new directors every so often and staring roles go to different players.

That's why I am always hopeful. This season meant 7-5 or 8-4 hopeful. Back to back seasons with more than 7 wins would be a great step forward. Right now I'm hoping for 6-6. CMU and the Gophers changed things.

[State]

Originally Posted by Plate of Shrimp

What exactly brings Spartans back to SS every year?

Loyalty
Tailgating
Game atmosphere
Hope for things to turn the corner (Which I think they will eventually with )
East Lansing
Enjoy football
Friends and family

Whatever, people have their reasons. I've been doing the same thing for so long on fall Saturdays, it's hard to imagine to not be at SS for a home game

[Negotiator]

Originally Posted by SpartyOnSpartyUp

You're right... we don't have a running threat yet we continue to try and pound it in from inside the 10. It's maddening. Last night on two separate occasions from inside the 5 we went run for no gain, run for no gain, incomplete pass. It's idiotic playcalling, so it goes to the coaches.

I understand the menatality. It's what Ohio State does to people every week. "You know what we're going to do. We know what we're going to do. The idiot drunken fan in the upper deck knows what we're going to do. Now try and stop us." Being in a situation where you can predict everything yet do nothing about it can devastate you. The problem is, MSU is no Ohio State, and whether it's an attempt at morale building, or forcing the offense to man up and become greater than they are, at the current point it's not happening for whatever reason. Maybe it would be different if MSU had Winston. But they don't.

[DantonIzzo]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

Most you can look at when deciding on return on investment etc is 20 years with respect to a program.

for many of us it;s less than that. Me personally it;s 15 years or so of being a fan. My return is very small.

I call bull**** on this. MSU football has broken your heart time and time again in unfathomable ways. True. But could you possibly live vicariously through something else sports-related that is so entertaining? It's like a GD soap opera. Constant drama. Never know what's around the corner. A lot of heartbreak, but damn, when they hit, they HIT.

Think of all the times MSU has given you the sports rush of your life on the gridiron. Huge wins, ballistic crowds, upsets, etc., etc. Your return isn't small, and your need for Spartan football to fill some kind of void in your life isn't, either.

It's funny that you're asking fans why they can't find something better to do with their time without getting the third degree, when you are also complaining about your "small return" like they owe you something more.

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by GRR Spartan

Mikey Mikey Mikey. It isn't the same movie every year.
There are new directors every so often and staring roles go to different players.

That's why I am always hopeful. This season meant 7-5 or 8-4 hopeful. Back to back seasons with more than 7 wins would be a great step forward. Right now I'm hoping for 6-6. CMU and the Gophers changed things.

GRR, I know you dont really like my work or me but work with me for one second here....

Arent games like CMU and last night the same movie? sans last season when have we ever not had games like that? It;s essentially become an accepted part of MSU football....not for people like me but for many here.

[Coach Hoski]

Originally Posted by State

Compared to MSU:

Jeazus. We are lucky to have this coach. MFer has his faults, but if we can swing three straight bowls then this is progress. Next year we have an easy schedule though, he's gotta win eight MINIMUM, or I will lose some faith. Since my opinion matters...

[MSchott]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

Couple posters made refference to this so let me lump the response into one...

I know alot of guys who have season tickets and some go no matter what, others have ZERO patience and go to 2 games....

I never imagined a day when going to SS would not be the highlight of my week. times change. the product doesnt. dont know when I'll decide to just not bother and thought this was an interesting question.

It does come down to priorities. I graduated 30 years ago, played in the SMB for 3 years and am a very loyal MSU sports fan. Yet I only get to 2-3 games a year as I have other priorities in my life like family, yardwork, faith and friends. I still watch every game and sometimes get so frustrated that my wife gets mad at me.

I'm not a fair weather fan though, Whether we go 9-3 or 3-9 I'm still a fan no matter what. If you're a true Spartan, you take the good with the bad. That doen't mean I'm happy with a poor record or performance but then again I don't expect perfection in all areas of the athletic department which is where I often have a problem with you Mike.

You never seem satisfied and are a typical sports fan which means looking at the product for immediate results rather than seeing the big picture. I'm not saying you don't have this perspective but so often your reactions like many here are of the knee jerk variety. I respect the passion but long for a more mature approach.

[MForce2k]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

OR dare I say it...inept coordinating.

Treadwell has had some serious issues over his three year run. Ringer covered up alot of it. we have a trememndous passing attack yet he refuses to use it in the red zone, more specifically inside the 10. Mindboggling. trememndous TE's, solid WR's...yet we bang away with ZERO success.

Go back and look at the film at how many times we line up power set inside 10 and run middle. It's a shocking number.

but what the ****, I'm not a coach so I cannot comment according to some here.

Couldn't agree more. This is one of the things I have ranted and raved about on this message board and others. The entire WORLD knows that we're going to run up the gut inside of the 10, or even the 5. Can you imagine that first time we just rolled out and made a pass? How great that would feel?

But every single time they get in the I and you see their entire D just salivating. It's incredibly frustrating. Nothing to the outside, nothing in the air, and eventually just 3 points on the board.

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by DantonIzzo

I call bull**** on this. MSU football has broken your heart time and time again in unfathomable ways. True. But could you possibly live vicariously through something sports-related that is so entertaining? It's like a GD soap opera. Constant drama. Never know what's around the corner. A lot of heartbreak, but damn, when they hit, they HIT.

Think of all the times MSU has given you the sports rush of your life on the gridiron. Huge wins, ballistic crowds, upsets, etc., etc. Your return isn't small, and your need for Spartan football to fill some kind of void in your life isn't, either.

It's funny that you're asking fans why they can't find something better to do with their time without getting the third degree, when you are also complaining about your "small return" like they owe you something more.

Well since you asked cornfed, they owe each person whatever that individual feels they owe.

for me? some consistency would be nice. A defensive coordinator that makes me feel like we take the field with a schematic advantage would be god too.

In the end MSU is a part of me, I care deeply. the time and money does not add up. for you it might and that is fine. Don't know what you are looking for except a fight.

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by MSchott

It does come down to priorities. I graduated 30 years ago, played in the SMB for 3 years and am a very loyal MSU sports fan. Yet I only get to 2-3 games a year as I have other priorities in my life like family, yardwork, faith and friends. I still watch every game and sometimes get so frustrated that my wife gets mad at me.

I'm not a fair weather fan though, Whether we go 9-3 or 3-9 I'm still a fan no matter what. If you're a true Spartan, you take the good with the bad. That doen't mean I'm happy with a poor record or performance but then again I don't expect perfection in all areas of the athletic department which is where I often have a problem with you Mike.

You never seem satisfied and are a typical sports fan which means looking at the product for immediate results rather than seeing the big picture. I'm not saying you don't have this perspective but so often your reactions like many here are of the knee jerk variety. I respect the passion but long for a more mature approach.

Fair.

[CarlsonSPARTY]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

OR dare I say it...inept coordinating.

Treadwell has had some serious issues over his three year run. Ringer covered up alot of it. we have a trememndous passing attack yet he refuses to use it in the red zone, more specifically inside the 10. Mindboggling. trememndous TE's, solid WR's...yet we bang away with ZERO success.

Go back and look at the film at how many times we line up power set inside 10 and run middle. It's a shocking number.

but what the ****, I'm not a coach so I cannot comment according to some here.

It seems to me that Dantonio wants to be known as a physical football team and this gets in the way of the best play call for the team in a given situation. I would like to see more bunch sets where we can sprint out our qb instead of just trying to prove we are the most physical team in the conference. I would also not mind it if we would occasionally run outside near the goaline. The play action pass on third down (first goaline oppurtunity) was awful as well; not fooling anyone on that one.

[fishrose]

Originally Posted by MSchott

It does come down to priorities. I graduated 30 years ago, played in the SMB for 3 years and am a very loyal MSU sports fan. Yet I only get to 2-3 games a year as I have other priorities in my life like family, yardwork, faith and friends. I still watch every game and sometimes get so frustrated that my wife gets mad at me.

I'm not a fair weather fan though, Whether we go 9-3 or 3-9 I'm still a fan no matter what. If you're a true Spartan, you take the good with the bad. That doen't mean I'm happy with a poor record or performance but then again I don't expect perfection in all areas of the athletic department which is where I often have a problem with you Mike.

You never seem satisfied and are a typical sports fan which means looking at the product for immediate results rather than seeing the big picture. I'm not saying you don't have this perspective but so often your reactions like many here are of the knee jerk variety. I respect the passion but long for a more mature approach.

The only way you could have said it better would be to use more swears <3

[DantonIzzo]

Originally Posted by Sportsinferno

Well since you asked cornfed, they owe each person whatever that individual feels they owe.

for me? some consistency would be nice. A defensive coordinator that makes me feel like we take the field with a schematic advantage would be god too.

In the end MSU is a part of me, I care deeply. the time and money does not add up. for you it might and that is fine. Don't know what you are looking for except a fight.

Your problem is simply lack of patience, which goes with the territory considering your profession and personna.

Need proof? See your basketball thread from a year ago.

I know, I know -- 40 years of this. However, this is only Year 3 of Dantonio. If you aren't willing to give him and his staff the benefit of the doubt that they'll have the corner turned in the not-so-distant future, I don't know what to tell you other than stop going and stop paying attention. If you can't quit, then you're just going to have to take your medicine and be more patient. A football program isn't rebuilt overnight -- it's not like basketball, where you sign 1-2 studs and you can automatically become golden.

[vator88]

Originally Posted by MForce2k

Couldn't agree more. This is one of the things I have ranted and raved about on this message board and others. The entire WORLD knows that we're going to run up the gut inside of the 10, or even the 5. Can you imagine that first time we just rolled out and made a pass? How great that would feel?

But every single time they get in the I and you see their entire D just salivating. It's incredibly frustrating. Nothing to the outside, nothing in the air, and eventually just 3 points on the board.

[Babies Need Tickets]

Originally Posted by CarlsonSPARTY

It seems to me that Dantonio wants to be known as a physical football team and this gets in the way of the best play call for the team in a given situation. I would like to see more bunch sets where we can sprint out our qb instead of just trying to prove we are the most physical team in the conference. I would also not mind it if we would occasionally run outside near the goaline. The play action pass on third down (first goaline oppurtunity) was awful as well; not fooling anyone on that one.

I think this is absolutely the case.

I also predict that while the playcalling may cost us a few games in the short run, eventually we're going to begin converting those same plays, and when we do people will rave about how they "love the toughness," without giving any thought to how that toughness developed.

[Negotiator]

Eh. In the end, those of you confronting other ticketholders with calls for Spartan Cards enjoy whatever feelings that perceived indignation provokes. As for myself, I will enjoy the last two outings for season #7, making an elaborate feast for the Penn State game as is my tradition. If I am fortunate enough to gain employment with the armed forces, seasons 8 and 9 will see me requesting days off for each home game, with season 10 being a sendoff and watching all 12 games live. After that, who knows.

[Sportsinferno]

Originally Posted by DantonIzzo

Your problem is simply lack of patience, which goes with the territory considering your profession and personna.

Need proof? See your basketball thread from a year ago.

I know, I know -- 40 years of this. However, this is only Year 3 of Dantonio. If you aren't willing to give him and his staff the benefit of the doubt that they'll have the corner turned in the not-so-distant future, I don't know what to tell you other than stop going and stop paying attention. If you can't quit, then you're just going to have to take your medicine and be more patient. A football program isn't rebuilt overnight -- it's not like basketball, where you sign 1-2 studs and you can automatically become golden.

I think you are misreading me.

Dantonio has my COMPLETE trust and faith.

Narduzzi and Treadwell do not. especially NArduzzi.

[Touchdown MSU]

I was at the '06 OSU and Minnesota games. I can stay home once if I want!

But seriously-Western Michigan is the problem for me. If this was a Bigten game I'd be there. I have no interest killing a full day for this game at this point.