Kirk Cousins on the 2 QB System

groverj3 · 11-03-2009, 02:21 PM

Because the 2 qb system is totally making our defensive backs fall asleep when the ball is thrown in their general direction

Spartan1985 · 11-03-2009, 02:22 PM

Cosuins didn't have that great of game of either, I don't care if K- Mart was at QB in the game, Treadwell doesn't get the red zone offense, 2 first and goal's and six points? There are bigger problems on this team than the play of the QB.

dagomike · 11-03-2009, 02:24 PM

I'm a big MD fan, but that move made no sense. If Cousins got shook up or if the offense needed a spark, then OK. But Cousins was playing well, the team seemed getting back on track.

Nichol is a great QB and I'm confident we can win with him. But he's been out with injury and was bought in cold during a pivotal part of the game. No good reason to put him in, and few good reasons to not to, at least at that moment.

J T · 11-03-2009, 02:25 PM

It appears Dantonio suffers from the same problem that people always bitch about with Izzo. Guy gets hot, gets taken out. Hmm...

SpartanGA · 11-03-2009, 02:27 PM

that Nichol hop pass to BJ was HORRIBLE. Let Nichol scramble for a play or two..then put Cousins back in.

Final Countdown · 11-03-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpartanGA

that Nichol hop pass to BJ was HORRIBLE. Let Nichol scramble for a play or two..then put Cousins back in.

I know! It's amazing that the coaching staff still regards Nichol so highly considering that he throws at least a few bounce-passes each game.

lmc55 · 11-03-2009, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Tailgate

Yeah... Karsch and Gator thought that was a curious statement and wonder what kind of waves may be going through MSU's lockerroom.

But don't worry, because they also think Michigan is fine and have been where people expected them to be when the season began.... so all is well in AA.

I swear to ****ing Christ... I so wanna take a day off of work so I can call these buffoons and give them a piece of my mind. They're absolutely awful.

I turned their show off today. Honestly, Gator just let's Karsch take his subtle hits at the MSU football program, and doesn't say a damn thing. But, when the subject of UM football program comes up he'll say something along the lines of...I think that Rodriguez is the guy for UM and he's going to bring that program back. He's a great coach....yada yada yada.

froot loops · 11-03-2009, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan1985

Cosuins didn't have that great of game of either, I don't care if K- Mart was at QB in the game, Treadwell doesn't get the red zone offense, 2 first and goal's and six points? There are bigger problems on this team than the play of the QB.

I've heard the rationalization that there are other bigger issues than at QB. Yes this is correct, but some of those bigger issues are only solved by time and new recruits. The QB issue is something they can address right now. The Spartans margin error is not big enough to play around with. I've not seen anything Nichol does to think that his continued insertions does anything to make the offense better.

Bruce Banner Ad · 11-03-2009, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by froot loops

The craziest thing about the continued insistence on putting a backup into the game like Dantonio is doing is his explanation leaves to to think that they are doing it based on drawing out of a hat. Yesterday he said they planned on bringing him is for at least a series versus Minnesota. OK, fine, its still a stupid plan but thats what he wants to do.

Sometimes plans should be changing when you are down 14-0 before taking a snap in a critical game. Its like they put numbers in a hat and pulled out drive #4. That was the time he was going to go in. Dantonio is talking like its the preseason in the NFL. You are 9 games in brother, you have a good QB in Cousins who is a lot better than Nichol. You don't have a good enough team to be throwing away drives.

And no matter what Cousins says, its not a dead issue and I'm sure he and other players on the team are scratching their heads. No team is preparing for a Nichol offense because that offense isn't any different nor is it explosive. This is not a Leak/Tebow situation.

It's basically the same as using a random number generator to determine when they're going to play which QB. To say, "We're going to play Nichol in the second quarter, regardless of the game situation," is utterly moronic, and ignoring the very real consequences of failure. The staff has treated this whole season like it's practice.

Here's a crazy idea: why not put in Nichol inside the OTHER TEAM'S ten, and call a bootleg? Even alternating them against um seemed to be effective, b/c they both can run, (although that isn't much of a sample, um is terrible). But to repeat the EXACT SAME mistake they made against wusconsin in taking Cousins out when he was hot doesn't speak very well of our staff's collective intelligence.

lmc55 · 11-03-2009, 02:47 PM

[QUOTE=Dr. Tailgate;6282318]Yeah... Karsch and Gator thought that was a curious statement and wonder what kind of waves may be going through MSU's lockerroom.

Why in the heck do they think that it's a curious statement? Of course Cousins doesn't want to be taken out of the game. Do they want him to say, gee I thought it was the perfect time to take me out.

These two guys are idiots and I have stopped listening to their show.

Brian T. · 11-03-2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by groverj3

Because the 2 qb system is totally making our defensive backs fall asleep when the ball is thrown in their general direction

Clearly the defensive backfield is a bigger problem, but the use of the 2 QB system as MD is using it has an effect on the team and the game - so it is an issue. This thread isolates the discussion to this issue and in no way represents all issues on the team. If you want to discuss this particular issue, then please feel free to comment. If you prefer to talk about the defense issues that are clearly a bigger problem, then maybe you should start a thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan1985

Cosuins didn't have that great of game of either, I don't care if K- Mart was at QB in the game, Treadwell doesn't get the red zone offense, 2 first and goal's and six points? There are bigger problems on this team than the play of the QB.

Yes, there are bigger problems. Why can't this one be discussed?

monty4msu · 11-03-2009, 03:02 PM

Let me see if i have this right. KN starts one game, plays almost the entire game, and the team wins. KC starts two games in a row, and plays all of one, and most of the other, and the team loses. Granite the win for KN was over UI, but one of the losses for KC was Minne. Some guys know how to win. I would prefer to win ugly than to lose pretty. IF KC says, its hard to get pulled after a drive, imagine how hard it is to go into a game cold, and then have to be perfect on every play. The reason imo that KN did as well as he did against UI was b/c he wasnt worried that every single play was the final exam. That said, i do agree that the problems on this team are much deeper than the qb play.

goodbar · 11-03-2009, 03:10 PM

There are only two people I have unconditional faith on after watching this mediocre season. Kirk Cousins and Blair White. You just KNOW they will perform and get it done.

Sure, the ND interception was bad. But on an overall basis these are two players that you just....don't.....have...to worry about. When Nichol is in I cringe as he draws back to pass. When the ball is heading to Dell or Cunningham or anyone not named Blair White I'm also on the edge of my seat.

SpartyHardy · 11-03-2009, 03:11 PM

Forgetting the defensive issues for MSU...which are far more massive. The main problem with the 2 QB system isn't the use of both of them, but when and how they are being used. Taking KC out on the series immediately following a TD scoring drive which gave them some much needed momentum and got them back into the game was just incomprehensable, especially given the fact where MSU started it's drive on the field deep in their own territory and that Nichol was coming off an injury. I was as stunned and perplexed by that decision as anyone and I do think that it was a momentum killer for MSU at precisely the wrong time.

Now I'm not against using KN during the game given the right situation and circumstance, but the way it was done at Minny was just absolutely mind boggling and it's really hard to defend

decision in that instance.

goodbar · 11-03-2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpartyHardy

Forgetting the defensive issues for MSU...which are far more massive. The main problem with the 2 QB system isn't the use of both of them, but when and how they are being used. Taking KC out on the series immediately following a TD scoring drive which gave them some much needed momentum and got them back into the game was just incomprehensable, especially given the fact where MSU started it's drive on the field deep in their own territory and that Nichol was coming off an injury. I was as stunned and perplexed by that decision as anyone and I do think that it was a momentum killer for MSU at precisely the wrong time.

Now I'm not against using KN during the game given the right situation and circumstance, but the way it was done at Minny was just absolutely mind boggling and it's really hard to defend

decision in that instance.

I could not have said it any better. My friggin jaw just dropped when I saw that. "Thanks Kirk! Awesome drive. We back in this. Now have a seat."

PisPotPete · 11-03-2009, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monty4msu

Granite the win for KN was over UI,

Is it written in stone or something?

Brian T. · 11-03-2009, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monty4msu

Let me see if i have this right. KN starts one game, plays almost the entire game, and the team wins. KC starts two games in a row, and plays all of one, and most of the other, and the team loses. Granite the win for KN was over UI, but one of the losses for KC was Minne. Some guys know how to win. I would prefer to win ugly than to lose pretty. IF KC says, its hard to get pulled after a drive, imagine how hard it is to go into a game cold, and then have to be perfect on every play. The reason imo that KN did as well as he did against UI was b/c he wasnt worried that every single play was the final exam. That said, i do agree that the problems on this team are much deeper than the qb play.

Exactly the point. Why was he even put in?

Yes, he won against Illinois. 13-25 with a pick against them doesn't scream "The job is mine!", but he did win thanks to solid defense (including a Fortener pick for a TD). Cousins has been solid and has been victim to some horrible defense and has done nothing to be pulled from a game.

Death Roe · 11-03-2009, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PisPotPete

Is it written in stone or something?

monty4msu · 11-03-2009, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian T.

Exactly the point. Why was he even put in?

Yes, he won against Illinois. 13-25 with a pick against them doesn't scream "The job is mine!", but he did win thanks to solid defense (including a Fortener pick for a TD). Cousins has been solid and has been victim to some horrible defense and has done nothing to be pulled from a game.

Once again, bottom line, "Yes, he won against Illinois". Point being, KN WON. Who on this board predicted a loss to Minne? Not many, self included. But with KC at qb for almost the entire game, we LOST. Dont hang the blame for the Minne loss on KN who only played one series. All i am saying is, Winners Win.

froot loops · 11-03-2009, 03:22 PM

The best thing about this silly two QB system is listening to Blaha and Miller try to hide their frustation when Nichol is inserted. It is against every fiber of Blaha to not be enthusiastic. He's even enthusiastic about the opponent, but when Nichol is inserted Blaha turns into Steven Wright.

MichState04 · 11-03-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by groverj3

Because the 2 qb system is totally making our defensive backs fall asleep when the ball is thrown in their general direction

So our offense is perfect and there is no room for improvement.

Got it, thanks

MichState04 · 11-03-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by froot loops

The best thing about this silly two QB system is listening to Blaha and Miller try to hide their frustation when Nichol is inserted. It is against every fiber of Blaha to not be enthusiastic. He's even enthusiastic about the opponent, but when Nichol is inserted Blaha turns into Steven Wright.

Spyke · 11-03-2009, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan Punk

I would have no problem with Nichol coming in after KC's had a few drives stall out (like in the first half vs ND) or to bring him in during certain situations, ie inside the 5 yard line, 3rd and short, etc. But to bring him in cold inside our own 5 yard after we had just scored was mind boggling. Did he really think that KN had a better chance to drive the team 95 yards than KC did?

Pretty much agree. Although, I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to him taking snaps deep in MSU territory if we we ran some plays designed to take advantage of his attributes. At that position on the field, it would be nice to pick up a first down without having to pass the ball and a QB draw or option play would have been a nice call. However, once it got to be 3rd and 5, you've got to put KC back in to make the pass.

MSchott · 11-03-2009, 03:36 PM

At this time in the season there is no 2 QB system. It's quite obvious that Cousins is the starter. Nichol played one series in the Minnesota game and not at all in the previous 2 games.

By the way Nichol's QB rating for the year is an impressive 136 so he's still a pretty good player.

Brian T. · 11-03-2009, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monty4msu

Once again, bottom line, "Yes, he won against Illinois". Point being, KN WON. Who on this board predicted a loss to Minne? Not many, self included. But with KC at qb for almost the entire game, we LOST. Dont hang the blame for the Minne loss on KN who only played one series. All i am saying is, Winners Win.

Who is blaming the loss on KN? No one.

Yeah, winners win. Ryan Leaf won a game once, too.